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I swear gamers have the memory of a gnat
It’s more a “sucker born every minute” thing.
Don’t know. Don’t play a whole lot of Bethesda games. Didn’t play Oblivion. New gamers join the ranks every day. Not everyone has been gaming since the 80’s.
This is what happens everywhere: they’ll just keep chancing it until such a time as it’s acceptable.
You have to understand.
The overwhelming bulk of gamers just don’t care
Nothing will stand in the way of getting their current precious. Not even their own complaints and bitching.
They’ll sit there and complain about how a company is evil, its practices exploitative, and how everyone should avoid buying from them so they can die in the fires of Bankruptcy.
Then the second the next game/expansion/DLC/Whatever is announced, they are immediately in line to preorder the ultra deluxe mega fuck you 500 dollar package. because it comes with a unique mount and a special armor skin, and they just cant miss those things! they’re rare! and they’ll never be able to get them otherwise! /s
And then they’ll go into the obfuscated-cash-shop and spend another 700 dollars on digital bullshit.
Then, when they are all done, the overwhelming majority of them will come back to the internet, and cry and whinge and moan about how a company is evil, its practices exploitative, and how everyone should avoid buying from them so they can finally die in the fires of bankruptcy.
Cause the majority of gamers are brain damaged fucktards who, at the end of the day, just love throwing their wallet at things.
I mean this is kind of true of all people everywhere. The marshmallow test has flaws but I think it’s still revealing. A lot of people are really bad at self control and delayed gratification.
Well most modern gamers are probably like 14 years old and probably never even played Skyrim. So I’m not surprised young kids are buying this creation kit garbage with Mommy’s credit card.
Starfield could have been a way better game if all they did was fuck it up like 45% less. They could have alternatively just delivered on their promises of making the game easy to mod and let the community handle the rest but they fucked that up too. Only the most dedicated of Starfield fan would have the patience to sit down and do all the shit it takes to add a new quest for example. Iirc even Skyrim came with a mod editor with ui that was easy to understand. Right now all we have is a community xedit project that’s somehow even harder to run on Linux than Starfield is.
Starfield’s big problem is it’s a huge universe built on an engine that really can’t support massive worlds like that. The reason you can’t fly around on the surface of a planet is because their crappy engine can’t cope with that much space existing, and it can’t load more environment when you get to the edges like every other game does because their engine doesn’t support proper level streaming.
If you mod the game to force the issue it gets glitchy very very quickly.
Skyrim came with a built-in mod editor?
Are you perhaps thinking of the manager they added on Xbox?
They always release their “Creation Kit” which is apparently also what the Bethesda employees use to build the quests and NPCs in their games:
- https://store.steampowered.com/app/1946180/Skyrim_Special_Edition_Creation_Kit/
- https://store.steampowered.com/app/1946160/Fallout_4_Creation_Kit/
- https://store.steampowered.com/app/2722710/Starfield_Creation_Kit/
.
The Starfield Creation Kit was only released a week ago (but I think to remember that there was a big delay in its release for Skyrim and Fallout, too - haven’t done any modding since the Skyrim days).
That sounds like a lot of work. And what for? The game sold well, the next one will as well. Why people buy it? I have no idea.
There was this editor that let you make esm files. I can’t remember if it was already in the game folder or you had to download from steam but it must not have been hard to set up. I remember using it to make one of the buyable houses really big on the inside.
Starfield could have been a way better game if all they did was fuck it up like 45% less.
Compared to the KOTOR series, it was lifeless. Compared to Mass Effect, it was very boring. Frustrating for a game with such strong precedents to land so weakly. But they put so much energy into quantity of content that they forgot to invest in quality.
They could have alternatively just delivered on their promises of making the game easy to mod and let the community handle the rest but they fucked that up too.
The goal was to create a game that procedurally generated itself, not one where individual hobbyists expanded it manually.
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I’m glad I’m not the only one to remember that Dragon Age: Origins quest.
Its the specific and singular reason why I never bought any of the DLC, or any of the sequels.
The company that introduced horse armor is charging horrendous prices for small DLC?
I mean considering that single skins cost 20 in Overwatch or Dead by Daylight, 7 for an actual mission is almost generous.
Fuck gaming is fucked…
It’s fucked because there are people buying that shit, in numbers that turn a profit over the cost of developing it. And it’s a very low cost because the skin support is something they put in when they make the game, and then get an intern to shit out a gaudy skin.
If you don’t like it you’re obviously not the target demographic anymore. It’s mobile gaming tactics creeping their way on PC.
Eh, skill up had a great take on this. The thing is it’s wayyyyy easier to be a small indie developer than it ever was before. Making a game (or any art) still isn’t easy, it never was and never will be, but it’s viable without a giant publisher in a way it just hasn’t been before.
Its the AA titles that are on the most precarious footing, but I bet even those do ok. Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy some AAA stuff time to time, I’ve got a stupid amount of hours in overwatch, but I’ve never once paid for a skin because… why would you?
The thing that’s going to suck is losing the studios like Arkane. Their games weren’t perfect but they were freaking cool, and they basically always got the raw end of the deal. Even Prey(2016), their masterpiece, is the product of corporate bullshitiery they had nothing to do with. So we’re probably going to miss studios like that for a while (as they get re-tasked to fortnite/cod support teams) but “indie” stuff has already been stepping up to fill that void, and is less indie all the time.
Look at Dave the Diver. That’s not exactly an indie studio. They had resources. There’s going to be a gap for a bit, but there’s still a demand for good games and art. Those AA breakthroughs are what people want. Again, I continue to spend dumb amounts of time on overwatch, but it’s not where I spend my money. Microsoft hovelled themselves by buying all these studios and not taking the leap with supporting them. Distribution just doesn’t have the value it once did. So if microsoft wants to become CandyCrush, feeding an addiction loop to grab the whales, sure, whatever, but there’s plenty of bread out there for studios doing other stuff.
The one and only point that I disagree with you on is your take on mtx. They may not affect you, but everything about them is designed to be psychologically exploitative, and the wealthy whale is largely a myth. The vast majority of money from mtx is made from people with addiction issues and other mental health issues or atypical neurology, like people with depression or ADHD.
Microsoft bought up all those studios and didn’t support them, but that’s business as usual for Microsoft, and the money that they’ll make from mtx like this will more than make up for it. I recently watched a former Blizzard dev who was talking about how a single $15 mount for WoW made more money than StarCraft 2 did.
The big issue I see is that most people largely don’t know about anything beyond the big AAA releases, and as we’ve already established, that’s an exploitative wasteland nowadays. There’s plenty of demand for good games and there always will be, but while the indie scene is the best that’s it’s ever been, the majority of indie companies go under after their first game. It’s still hard out there for them, too. There’s just enough of them popping up and putting out truly great games that they can actually compete with the AAA space.
I kind of feel like anyone who spends $20 on a video game skin shouldn’t be allowed to make any financial decisions for themselves. Like, it was a test and you failed.
Except that shit is designed by literal psychologists to prey upon people with poor fiscal responsibility, like people with ADHD, depression, addiction issues, and kids.
It’s like blaming people for smoking cigarettes after they got addicted from secondhand smoking.
It should be standard practice for Bethesda games to wait for a game of the year edition (or whatever they want to call it) then wait for a steam sale on that.
Bold of you to assume it will come included.
So some people are actually playing starfield?
Seven dollars to loading screen to your ship, watch an animation of your character sitting down, loading screen to space, loading screen to the system it’s in, Dodge some pirates, loading screen to the surface, hop along the completely barren landscape to go to a copy pasted outpost, loading screen back to your ship?
I feel like you could get all of the value of that dlc by just playing a mission over again.
This…this right here is the reason I quit playing this game, the reason I couldn’t quite put my finger on. It was just too fucking disjointed, you are so right.
I didn’t make it very far in to the game, I’d held on to my game pass subscription just waiting for it to come out, and cancelled my game pass after a few hours in Starfield. I made it to like the first big city a few small settlements after that, and everything felt so fucking lifeless. NPCs just didn’t seem to belong in the space they inhabited. Oblivion and Skyrim NPCs really seemed like they owned the space they inhabited. Fallout 4 even once you got your settlements going really felt like they were home. The constant loading screens just made everything feel like it’s own little universe, apart from the rest of the game. I did have fun raiding some base around the moon, one of the few times I had fun exploring. One of the few times I had fun, honestly.
The most fun I had in Starfield was probably a zero-G fight at one point, can’t remember if it was the main storyline or not. But I got as far as the final main quest line fight, after which New Game+ would become available. I realized before going into it that…I just didn’t care. And I am not one to experience the sunken cost fallacy. So I just logged out, canceled Xbox PC Game Pass, and did something else.
I haven’t played this so take my 2 cents with a pinch of mixed metaphor.
My assumption for this game was that DLC would be new copy pasted outposts, weapons, etc. That’s the way a lot of procedural games go. It’s not bad really, you take a good core game and pump it full of new set pieces and toys til hell freezes over.
How does that horrible game even have players?
I’m sure a rational response is just going to get downvoted to oblivion, but it’s actually a fun game. Not my favorite from Bethesda, but I definitely enjoyed the 1k hours I put into it last year, and I look forward to dipping back in once the DLC drops and there are more mods (not paid creations) available.
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Well no downvotes from me, that’s a valid opinion.
What do you do for 1k hours in Starfield?
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You nailed it. The ship-building, especially with the early mods that allowed more part rotation and clipping, REALLY sucked me in. I am excited to check out the enhancements BGS added to that system when I next play.
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There was a mod that allowed you to (mostly) control door placement, but I’m not sure if it’s even still needed.
Base building, charting planets, roleplaying, bounty hunting, going to NG+, making different decisions in questlines, and more.
The game is actually pretty good.
You’re the actual proof that unpopular opinion does not result in downvotes to oblivion.
From now on : « remember that guy who said he LIKED Starfield… »
It’s free on gamepass
Starfield has a lot of good aspects, but also some bone-headed gameplay and content decisions. I had a lot of fun with it for a few weeks and will come back to it if/when it gets to a better state.
Tribalism is surprisingly rampant in gaming, especially when a developer picks a side/is acquired by the creator of “their” console.
People want to believe their lie.
Sunk cost, they pre-ordered it, and they are darn well going to play it, even if they don’t enjoy doing so.
Don’t pull the video games especially when they’re digitally distributed. It’s not like they can run out.
Or they actually enjoy it. Just because you and others don’t doesn’t mean everyone doesn’t. I didn’t pay anything for it and thoroughly enjoyed it, and will do so more when the DLC comes out. As with anything there are valid points of criticism but so much of the hate for it is fully because of people’s idiocy and not anything else, I’ve never before seen so much deeply stupid criticism for something.
I have no problem with people liking it. But I know for a fact that a lot of people really are just obsessed with it because they got bamboozled into pre-ordering, because Bethesda, and they don’t want to admit they made a mistake.
Ah, so that’s why it was lacking content.
Players could like stop paying for it… such an easy, low cost solution…
That is my current solution. Currently enjoying Factorio, which had the perfect monetization scheme: you buy the game and enjoy it.
Factorio also interestingly, never goes on sale, Wube said that the value of the game is what it is and that’s that.
This only works because it’s like $30. If this was a $60-70 game, I don’t think it goes over well with the public. Nintendo is the only one that seems to get away with that
I think that’s exactly the point though. “We didn’t mark it up to mark it down, the price is just the price”. As a chronic patient gamer part of me hates that (I love finding older classics for like $10) but I don’t mind shelling out for a good game. The biggest expense is my time, and if a bunch of years later the price hasn’t moved it’s probably worth my time.
That’s my route. Mods run on pirate skyrim just as well as legal and the best missions in Bethesda games aren’t made by Bethesda.
I got starfield for free with my video card, and I still feel ripped off and wish I could refund lol.
But yeah, I’m not dropping a single goddamn penny on Starfield. It feels like a game that was made for the xbox 360 or something, with all the loading screens and shit.
You get baited into accepting the quest and playing the first mission. Then you have to pay to continue.
WTF! That shit shouldn’t be legal.
Fallout 5 is going to suck
Fallout 4 sucked, too.
Its a fun shooter game, but its not a fallout. Throwing supermutants into a game doesnt make it a Fallout. Especially with how they fucked SPECIAL.
Fallout TV is probably the last decent product from Bethesda, and I’d wager thats only cause Bethesda isnt in charge of writing.
Fallout 4 is like 4 different games crammed into a trench coat.
- high emotion story game. Go rescue your child!
- high action shooter. Boom! Headshot!
- stats driven RPG. That naked bandit is level 40 so you can’t kill him even if you shotgun his face
- settlement management game. Build and decorate a little town! Set up trade routes!
All of these are kind of badly done, and mashing them all together didn’t make something greater than the parts.
Fallout 3’s world doesn’t feel like Fallout but the tone of the writing comes close.
Fallout 4’s tone and writing doesn’t feel like Fallout, but the world does.
New Vegas is the only 3D Fallout game that feels like Fallout in both the world and the writing.
I can almost guarantee that unless Josh Sawyer and the other original talent that made 1, 2, and tactics that also worked on New Vegas are working on it, it will never feel like a true Fallout game.
I would love for Obsidian to get another crack at Fallout, but I don’t think they are the only ones capable of making a good fallout game (though they would undoubtly be the best).
It just takes passion for the property, and a vested interest in the world. Something Bethesda is clearly lacking. Bethesda seems to be in the phase of “throw darts at a bunch of sticky notes on the wall” of trying to figure out how to make a game, and it just leads to a disjointed experience.
For me it’s the fundamental difference in design philosophy. Bethesda does power fantasies, which works great for TES, but not for Fallout. You should be barely scraping by, not making the wasteland your bitch.
Obsidian is off doing things and making games better than Fallout, they’d only come back because their studio isn’t extremely profitable and needs the cash.
Really though, please just go buy their games and play them. Outer Worlds got slated as pretty average but I’m still really excited to play that and Outer Worlds 2.
Outer Worlds is a great, fun game.
The only bad thing about it is idiot gamers heard the basic premise, and that Obsidian was making it, and immediately stroked their hype boners up over “OMG NEW VEGAS IN SPACE!” when it was nothing of the sort.
I hate modern gaming. Opinions aren’t allowed to be held. I don’t like this thing so ITS THE WORST OF THAT THING
I hate having discussions. Opinions aren’t allowed to be held because theres always some entitled ass that has to come in and misrepresent what everyones saying so they can fulfill their personal fantasy of being offended and attacked.
Once you take high school English your teacher will tell you not to write “in my opinion” in front of everything you write because it is unnecessary. Of course it is your option, you said it.
Someone with basic logic can extrapolate from that that if someone says something like “Fallout 4 is bad” that is clearly someone presenting an opinion and not an objective truth.
Eh, I liked it better than 3.
talk about damning with faint praise…
I had fun with both. Fallout 4’s flaws are still there, but if you’re going to make a punching bag out of one of them, 4 is a better game than 3, IMO.
No ones disagreeing with that.
Fallout 3 was all around an inferior game. Not just an inferior fallout, but an inferior game, compared to 4.
Mostly cause Fallout 3 was a disjointed mess.
But just because Fallout 4 is better by comparison, Doesnt mean fallout 4 is good.
I hate beets. But give me the choice between a bowl of shit and a bowl of beets, and put a gun to my head? I’ll eat the beets gladly and happily. Doesnt mean I love them.
Better than 3 maybe, but doesn’t even hold a candle to New Vegas. Hell, id argue 3 with NV’s engine is leagues better.
The perk system was fine imo, but the fact that attributes (except for charisma) did not influence dialogue at all was extremely disappointing.
Roleplay opportunities were traded in for a better gunplay experience. It became an FPS, not an RPG.
Look the perk system was bad but it’s wasn’t Fallout New Vegas bad. It was okay for a Fallout game but they probably should’ve done level ups by doing each 5 levels gives you 2 SPECIAL points to spend rather than spending normal points on the core stats.
Company that scammed players scams players, more at 7.
They’re selling a single quest as dlc? I mean if you going to do dlc then at least make a full expansion.
Why waste time with lots of quest when few quest do trick
Right?
Bethesda just released an expansion for fallout 76. It’s a game that I’m fairly fond of, considering the amount of dislike I have for fallout 4, it improved on it in every way from the worldbuilding to building to the story, I could go on, point is, I like it.
The new expansion, the first map expansion and like 20 major updates in.
The new map is quite a large region. You’d expect a few side quests to unlock these other locations. Maybe some hidden gems. Maybe some cool NPCs outside of the main “expansion” right?
Its literally: A main quest that’s short (beat it in like 3 hours on the first day it dropped)
A single side quest that’s more of an optional objective on the main quest
A single new event
A single new boss.
Four things they added. Two of which can only be done once (bad formula for a game designed around repeating similar tasks)
They’ve just straight up gotten bad. There’s no love in their products anymore. It’s all taking the easiest way out, lacking any amount of real creativity.
I just want them to migrate from their shitty proprietary engine, buckle down on a good story and prioritizing fun.
This is not a new thing, even back in 2012 the much-beloved borderlands 2 got five new missions which cost $2 each.
The thing with those is that, while it was a small amount of content, it wasn’t just a mission, each was about an hour of repeatable content that was fairly fun to farm. At $2, they actually still felt worth it with as much fun as B2 was. If they had asked for like $10 each, people would have flipped out.
I’m not a Starfield player, but I would bet this is not even close to as good of a value proposition.
Pretty sure it’s more of a pricing issue.
Is repetitive buying of Bethesda games a new kind of litmus test for stupidity? I mean they do this shit constantly and people are still surprised when it happens. Did people really forget horse armor they tried to sell? Or forget about items that were free in Fallout 4, but had to be purchased in 76? It’s Bethesda and only one thing Todd dreams about is scamming another dollar from their fans.
Used to be that they’d sell you both worthless DLC and actually good DLC.
Knights of the Nine?* Awesome. Horse Armor? Worthless.
Similarly, Skyrim had Dawnguard and Dragonborn which were great. It also had Hearthfire which was kinda meh, but at least it had stuff to do and was cheap, so I’m not too mad about it.
*There was also Shivering Isles, but at the time that was marketed as an expansion pack, not merely a DLC.
Pretty sure shivering isles was Morrowind and horse armor/ nights I’m the nine was oblivion. Those would have come out years apart.I don’t know what I’m talking about this early
Thats not accurate at all. Shivering isles is oblivion and one of the best parts of the game.
I just buy Bethesda games years after release and have a blast playing them.
If you find that worth it, then sure. Although that won’t be the case soon it seems as Todd has a hardon for live services.
It began with horse armour…
