Today, like the past few days, we have had some downtime. Apparently some script kids are enjoying themselves by targeting our server (and others). Sorry for the inconvenience.

Most of these ‘attacks’ are targeted at the database, but some are more ddos-like and can be mitigated by using a CDN. Some other Lemmy servers are using Cloudflare, so we know that works. Therefore we have chosen Cloudflare as CDN / DDOS protection platform for now. We will look into other options, but we needed something to be implemented asap.

For the other attacks, we are using them to investigate and implement measures like rate limiting etc.

  • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    19
    arrow-down
    61
    ·
    1 year ago

    Well for now we’ll have to stick around with cloudflare. I’d just would like to see something managed by a decentralized network. I don’t know if it exists, it’s more of a sentiment or a general idea.

    • Tibert@compuverse.uk
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      66
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      If you don’t know what a content delivery network is, here : https://www.cloudflare.com/learning/cdn/what-is-a-cdn/

      A CND is very costly to run in an effective way. And because it is an intermediary server between the user and content server, the market is already pretty full. So competing with the CDN giants is practically impossible in a decentralised manner.

      Because of what a CDN does (cache website elements closer to the user, protect the website against ddos…), it cannot be a cheap weak server, or it’s the one which will get overwhelmed by the ddos, or even the users.

      Another limiting factor is that in decentralisation, that means different companies, and so many separate plans to pay, which is just impossible for a company.

      If it was decentralized, a company would have to go and pay 100 different companies (which is more expensive, du to the server costs and each companies having their own staff to may (even if it’s just 1 person per company)) just to offer a quick access to the users around the world, which is just impossible.

      • Muddybulldog@mylemmy.win
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        21
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        A CDN isn’t a great comparison to DDOS mitigations. CDN spreads the load amongst multiple locations that are distinct entities. Any one can be down and the rest functions fine. They generally exist on separate domains and are not inherently codependent.

        DDOS requires an inline solution. A layer acting as a man in the middle to deflect or absorb the traffic destined to Lemmy.world, for example. That’s not something that can be readily be decentralized while there’s only one ingress to Lemmy.world.

      • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        arrow-down
        9
        ·
        1 year ago

        I know well what a CDN is and that’s why I don’t understand why you build a DISTRIBUTED content delivery network on a single corporation. I mean, the whole architecture is based on decentralised servers that precache the content and share the service load. Why not create an independent network that provides this bandwidth and where each node is rewarded according to its contribution? I know blockchain is a term that pisses a lot of people off, but it’s basically the best way to incorporate trust and monetisation into a decentralised system.

    • Beetschnapps@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      19
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s an interesting question but the knee jerk reaction towards decentralization isn’t always a silver bullet. Bitcoin always screamed that concept while ignoring the role of clearinghouses. Decentralization can actually compound the issue. Not to dispel the solution but good to keep these things in mind.

      • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        6
        ·
        1 year ago

        It isn’t a silver bullet but in this case it is particularly suitable. I mean, the architecture of CDN is decentralised, but all these servers are controlled by ONE company. So why not leave the whole task to an independent network?

    • woelkchen@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      17
      ·
      1 year ago

      I think the biggest problem with such services is that they require lots of money to run which means that any well-meaning effort will eventually end up becoming a commercial service.

      • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        15
        ·
        1 year ago

        …and that’s where the blockchain comes in. This means that the individual contributions of the node operators can be directly recorded and compensated adequately.

          • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            10
            ·
            1 year ago

            Tell me a good argument why not? How would you reward those people that contribute to said netowork?

            • woelkchen@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              6
              ·
              1 year ago

              Tell me a good argument why not?

              The downsides of blockchain / cryptocurrency are well documented at this point.

              • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                arrow-down
                8
                ·
                edit-2
                1 year ago

                Yeah sure like with centralized solutions and big corpos too. What kind of argument is that?

                • woelkchen@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  4
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  Yeah sure like with centralized solutions and big corpos too.

                  The alternative to big corporations is not blockchain.

                  What kind of argument is that?

                  A better than “…and that’s where the blockchain comes in.”

                  I’m not discussing with a crypto bro about the already well documented downsides. Use a web search engine of your choice to look them up yourself.

                  • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    arrow-down
                    5
                    ·
                    1 year ago

                    So you’re just an ignorant guy who only ever looks at his side of the argument. I’m not saying it’s the cure-all. Blockchain has many problems but much more potential. It’s not the technology’s fault that it’s being exploited for money-making and scams.

    • johntash@eviltoast.org
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      11
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      You’re being down voted, but a p2p cdn is something that sort of already exists. IPFS is probably the most mature. As far as I know, it’d only work for static content though. It’s also an entirely different protocol so you’d have to use some sort of local gateway or plugin to make use of it.

      I have several vms and dedicated servers that I sort of use as a DIY cdn. No where near as spread out or capable as something like cloudflare, but its also not incredibly expensive to do on a small low performance scale. DDOS mitigation is another story though, generally that is best handled by large networks that can soak up the throughput.

      • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        4
        ·
        1 year ago

        Yeah it’s also more of a potential that I wanted to point out. Over the years that I have been involved with blockchain projects, I have developed a feeling for where blockchains and decentralised networks are suitable and where they are not. In this case, however, it seems very feasible to me. In the end, CDNs are nothing more than a server network that caches the data locally and distributes the bandwidth. This is exactly what an independent network could do with the advantage of the blockchain to remunerate the contributions of the individual node operators. But I see that the notion of blockchain triggers a great aversion in most people.

        • deepdive@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          I don’t have half the knowledge in IT you have, but i totally agree we should find a solution to seperate from mastadons who owns the whole network.

          It’s very similar to how we shouldn’t give big corpos like GAFAM willingly our data/privacy or our foodchain shouldn’t be controled by a few corpos who serve poison… (the list goes on).

          Most people just don’t care, they have nothing to hide or they won’t die if they eat one cheesburger from McDonald’s a week…

          But in the case of lemmy I think (personal opinion) It’s because it’s easier, simpler, faster to setup right now. I’m sure if they had a better solution to not depend on cloudflare they would chose the other solution.

          I mean your idea seems great, but how long would it take to put it inplace? How many highly qulified people are needed to make it work? How much will it cost…

          I hope that in the long run, lemmy instances are going to find a better solution 😀

          • PropaGandalf@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            3
            ·
            1 year ago

            I’m only talking about the long run. For now cloudflare is a solid service. I’d love to see some experental approaches tho maybe from other smaller instances.